Saturday, March 5, 2011

MSU Students Ignore Facts, Protest Decision Not to Charge Basketball Players for Alleged Sexual Assault

Last year, prosecutors decided not to charge two MSU basketball players with sexual assault in connection with an incident that reportedly occurred between Aug. 29 and Aug. 30. 

The September 29, 2010 Michigan Messenger reported as follows:  "Documents obtained by Michigan Messenger show two high-profile Michigan State University basketball players have been accused of committing sexual assault on campus in August. Despite the allegations, prosecutors have declined to take up the case, and the victim disputes the reasons offered for not bringing charges. The heavily redacted police report released by Ingham County Prosecutor Stuart Dunnings III alleges the two team members took turns assaulting an unidentified woman for nearly an hour in their Wonders Hall dormitory room late on Aug. 29 and into Aug. 30.  The police report indicates that one of the two players corroborated the victim’s story in his statement to police."  http://michiganmessenger.com/42253/msu-sexual-assault (Emphasis added.)

Fast forward to this week.  Again, from the Michigan Messenger: "Four Michigan State University students were arrested Wednesday night when they refused to leave the administration building on campus.  The students were part of a protest sponsored by the Coalition Against Sexual Violence, a campus group that formed last year. . . . .  The protest was called “A Day of Rage.” The Coalition began following Michigan Messenger’s report on an alleged sexual assault on campus at the end of August. The assault was allegedly perpetrated by two high profile basketball players. While one of the players appears to have corroborated the statement of the woman, Ingham County Prosecutor Stuart Dunnings III declined to press charges. Dunnings’ refusal to prosecute led to protests outside his downtown Lansing offices. And now the victim in the case and her attorneys have asked the Michigan Attorney General to review the case. Attorneys for the victim issued the following statement to Michigan Messenger:  'In our evaluation of the case, we believe that a criminal sexual assault occurred. Due to the refusal of the Ingham County Prosecutor to bring charges, we requested the Attorney General look into the matter.'” (Emphasis added.)  See http://michiganmessenger.com/47006/msu-students-arrested-in-campus-protest-over-sexual-assault

Is it any wonder the protestors are upset, given that one of the alleged rapists corroborated the "victim's" account? 

If that's really what happened, of course not.

Except it appears that's not what happened. It appears that rape activists have seized on an early, and innacurate, mischaracterization of what happened, ignoring later, more complete information, in order to assume that a vile rape occurred even though it's at least as likely that it didn't.

It appears this is what really happened:  "Despite numerous media reports indicating one of the men corroborated a story, [Ingham County Prosecutor Stuart] Dunnings said in the statement that the alleged suspect’s account of the alleged sexual assault does not match that of the complainant’s. Several factors in the police interviews differ. In the complainant’s interview, for instance, she states she asked the men to 'stop,' while the alleged suspect states in his interview she only said, 'I’m done,' and never directly used the word 'stop.'” See here.

More details: "Based on the transcripts from one of the men interviewed, Dunnings said the man did not corroborate the facts necessary to 'substantiate a criminal sexual assault charge.' In the transcripts, the interviewee tells two detectives the victim never explicitly asked either of the men to stop while having sex.  'She didn’t say stop,' the man told the detectives. 'She was like, ‘I’m done.’ According to the transcript, the man also told detectives that when she said she was done, he stopped, but the other man allegedly involved 'talked her into' continuing. She could have stopped, he told detectives during the interview.  'The tone of her voice was like, she was done, but then he talked her into it, and she just let him go,' he said. 'So I mean, I don’t really. I mean see, so like, I guess he talked her into it, but she, she could have stopped.'” See here.

More details: "Michigan Messenger flatly reported — with no corroborating information — that Dunnings was ignoring the police recommendation." And: "The story's claim that the MSU Police had recommended that the players be charged was based on the appearance on a police incident report of two lines that say 'Sexual penetration penis/vagina CSI1' and 'CSC 1st degree - pentration penis/ vagina' in a section called offense. But when MSU police spokeswoman Sgt. Florene Taylor was asked — in general — if MSU police ever make a recommendation in an incident report on a possible charge, she said no. 'It’s not a recommendation or a suggestion,' [Sgt. Florene] Taylor said. 'It’s a criminal report.' ” See here.

What we are left with is a typically murky situation where guys were pushing for sex, where the woman went along with it, and where the woman expressed grave concerns about the dirty deed after-the-fact.  It is a classic "he said/she said" narrative where the "he" side is both more plausible and can't be construed as "rape."

We have frequently noted the after-the-fact regret of young women to group sex: "This is a recipe for a false rape claim. Ground zero, in fact. We've seen this multiple times. The reasons are obvious: how on earth can she possibly explain this to a boyfriend, a parent, or a friend? How will she hold her head up on campus? Most sane young women will deeply regret that encounter after-the-fact and will worry that if word got out, it would destroy what's left of her reputation. The fear of 'slut shaming,' as the feminists call it, seems to spawn off-the-charts regret, and that is a false rape claim waiting to happen. Men should never, ever put themselves in this awful situation."  See here.

But facts be damned. Angry anti-rape activists have seized on the early, inaccurate news account that fits their agenda, ignoring more detailed news, because that's all they need. Because when the legend becomes fact, old cowboys and feminists alike insist on printing the legend.

They wring their hands and bellyache, "It’s a sad and unfortunate thing that college campuses are such a hotbed for sexual assault," see here, even though we've demonstrated on this site time and time again that they aren't.  And they decry the absence of justice for rape victims: “'I hope to inspire an open and honest conversation about how safe our community is,' says Elizabeth Battiste, 20. 'I’m not expecting the basketball players to be kicked off the team or convicted of a crime, but I want there to be justice for the victim. . . .  If I was a rapist, I would want to live in Ingham County,' says Battiste." See here.

All the moaning and the bellyaching and the hand-wringing does a grave, grievous disservice to actual rape victims. Why? Because the more the activists insist that crap cases that shouldn't be tried and that can't be won be brought to trial, the more they tell rape victims with legitimate cases that they shouldn't even bother seeking justice because it will be denied to them. 

The young activists' time would be better spent educating our young people that drunken group sex is a no-win for both young men and young women, and that asking our law enforcement and judicial systems to untangle murky "he said/she said" allegations after-the-fact is an impossibility.  That sort of effort would actually help matters. What they are doing now doesn't help anyone, least of all rape victims.

If this is the best case these protesters could find to make their point, that's a good sign -- it probably means rape isn't so rampant after all.

32 comments:

AfOR said...

it's not just post gang bang "regret" that can lead to False Rape Accusations though.

It is ANY future "regret" at ANY association with the men in question.

In my case it came after some 7 years of relationship and kids, then one day the women wake up and decide they "regret" the last 7 years, and THE EASIEST WAY FOR THEM TO BREAK THE RELATIONSHIP OFF IS TO MAKE AN FRA.

To quote an early comment on this site when it started, "Be suspicious of any rape accusation that solves more (perceived) problems (for the accuser) than it creates."

To these women a False Rape Accusation is a "one size fits all" solution.

In COURT papers in my case it is clear that I was either the EIGHTH or NINTH man to have allegedly raped her in her life... All her ex's etc, the only confusion is over a (prior to me) gang rape, in one statement she claims it was four guys, in another five guys, apparently gang rape is something that it is as easy to lose track of as how many beers you had last night....

AfOR said...

posted a comment earlier, now gone??

AfOR said...

OT but relevant


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1363145/Bad-girls-An-investigation-new-breed-young-women-bit-alienated-violent-brutally-sexualised-worst-male-yob.html

Axel said...

Scary case. And the lesson to young men is that if you have to talk her into before the fact (and of course,that's not rape), you might also have to talk her out of charging you with rape after-the-fact.

Anonymous said...

All of four people showed up for their "day of rage!"

The citizens of Egypt would not be impressed.

Anonymous said...

Why don't they protest in favor of an investigation to determine whether or not "the victim" should be charged with filing a false police report? Don't they have any decency?

Anonymous said...

The American gender-Raunch community stand fully behind this young girls actions of crying rape to get attention.
Every false rape accusation causes mass hysteria, and serves to further "Empower" the American gender-Raunch community as a united whole.

Anonymous said...

If every single false rape accusation made were thoroughly investigated, and charges for "Attempted perversion of justice", were handed out...The biggest effect it would have on society is the "American gender-Raunch Empowerment movement" would come to a grinding halt.

Eric J Schlegel said...

AfOr wrote:

"In my case it came after some 7 years of relationship and kids, then one day the women wake up and decide they "regret" the last 7 years, and THE EASIEST WAY FOR THEM TO BREAK THE RELATIONSHIP OFF IS TO MAKE AN FRA."

This is frightening. Can you tell the whole story here? I'm interested in knowing details.

AfOR said...

@ Eric

http://www.the-spearhead.com/2010/12/07/facing-rape-prosecution-in-the-uk-a-first-person-account/

There is a link to the pdf in the article.

NOT a detailed account, but a general summary.

Anonymous said...

20/2/2011: brutal rape in the center of Rome. Little innocent girl cries and will abandon Italy. Politicians fight over safety:
http://roma.repubblica.it/cronaca/2011/02/20/news/stupri_a_roma_pd_contro_sindaco-12676183/

5/3/2011: the rape was false. The innocent girl was playing an erotic game (pretending to be a feminist bitch), a condom got broken, "so" she invented a fake rape to get free medical assistance.
http://www.ilgiornale.it/interni/stupro_piazza_spagna_la_ragazza_inventa_tutto_era_solo_gioco_erotico/profilassi-confessione-spagna-roma-stupro-violenza/05-03-2011/articolo-id=509947-page=0-comments=4#1

Anonymous said...

If false rape accusers were punished it wouldn't have any impact on "gender raunch" at all.

All of the porn in all of the universe would still be on the internet... thank God!

Human-Stupidity.com said...

The problem, of course, is the re-definition of rape. Rape should be forcible, as it was for the last 20 000 years.

All this consensual sex that suddenly turns rape is ridiculous. There should be an even more heightened burden of proof for such cases. If ever there was consent, there should be extremely high burden of proof that she repeatedly told stop with extreme clarity.

Where would we get if all transactions could be reneged at all times?

If any supermarket could claim they changed their mind and did not want to sell an item and thus charge the client, on his way to the checkout register, with theft?

And any landlord could charge a tenant with break-in, because he suddenly reneged on the rental contract?

My article
Get a lawyer before sex: 27 precautions before risking sex with a woman
continues valid. It is not enough to get written consent in front of a notary public and to get a lab test that she is not under influence of drugs or alcohol.

Rather it is necessary to completely document every step and every moment, proving that afterwards she never ever changed her mind, or never got herself drunk so she would no more be capable of consent.

Insanity.

Anonymous said...

It is ironic that you accuse the activists of cherry picking information, when you yourself have done exactly that. You don't point any readers to the actual transcripts of the victim and alleged perpetrator statements, the police report and other detailed information. You also fail to note that three experts were asked to review the case and two said point blank a crime was committed, while a third said he would prefer to see more investigation. And finally, you also fail to note in the very same story you link to at Michigan Messenger that the Attorney General's Office is investigating the claim. If you are going to accuse others of ignoring facts, it's important you not do the same.

Link for story on AG investigation: http://michiganmessenger.com/47006/msu-students-arrested-in-campus-protest-over-sexual-assault

Link for police report and transcripts: http://www.ingham.org/PA/PDF/Press%20Release%20SJD.pdf

Links for experts sound off on reports: http://michiganmessenger.com/42396/experts-question-lack-of-action-on-alleged-msu-sexual-assault

So how about some intellectual honesty when you try to call others out for allegedly not having any?

AfOR said...

http://www.zdnet.com/blog/facebook/students-suspended-expelled-over-facebook-posts/517

Anonymous said...

We're too intelligent to credit feminist "experts." Sorry, but that scam doesn't work around here.

Anonymous said...

Also, preaching about "intellectual honesty" while continuing the policies of the Duke 88 is beyond satirical. That doesn't work around here, either.

Anonymous said...

It is ironic that you accuse the activists of cherry picking information, when you yourself have done exactly that.

***

They aren't just cherrypicking information: they are lying. Big difference.

You, on the other hand, are making the utterly fallacious claim that we are somehow "cherrypicking" when we don't post every statement and police report associated with the case (which would be ridiculous). There is no comparison between malicious misrepresentation and not dumping a hundred pages of documentation in every blog post.

And since we're so concerned about justice, why aren't you protesting the free lunch for Mangum, Todd and all of the other undisputably guilty false rape accusers in this country? You're man-haters, and that's all you are.

Anonymous said...

In short, when there is a 10% likelihood that a man has committed rape, you are 110% in favor of prosecution. But when there is a 100% chance that a man has been framed you are 0% in favor of prosecution.

Does this hypocrisy cause you to experience shame in any form? Are you any more capable of that than an insect?

Anonymous said...

More dancing. No surprise.

Anonymous said...

It will be a long, long time until a feminist comes here and says something logical. As usual, "We're liars? Oh yeah? Well so are you!" is what passes for an argument with them.

Anonymous said...

OT- Here is a misandrist attack, describing various men -- including falsely accused and cheaters -- as "creeps":

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/622556-the-50-biggest-creeps-in-sports#page/6

Anonymous said...

"More dancing. No surprise."

That's a long-time troll talking. An idiot, no less.

I read the cited documents and they only CONFIRM the post. The suspect who supposedly corroborated the accuser, in fact, made clear there was no rape. Not unless the accuser has no free will.

And as for "experts": sorry, we don't accept members of the paid sexual grievance industry as "experts."

Nice try.

Anonymous said...

Who were these experts, anyway? Phone operators for the Psychic Friends Network?

Freedom said...

Another case that demonstrates why you should keep their mouth shut when a cop tries to interview you. Even though you do not say anything bad, what you say can be made to look incredibly bad.

Freedom said...

@anon: I actually did not at first accept Pierce Harlan as an expert. After following up to double-check his analysis of report after report and article after article, I now have a reader-author trust relationship. None of my respect for what Pierce writes comes from him claiming expert status or his legal background. You can find a lawyer or credentialed person for just about any position you can dream up. Pierce has my and others readers' respect on the basis of quality, truthful writing day after day.

It would not surprise me though if he is a BA attorney who has also done incredible work for justice. And it would not surprise me if he needs to keep his identity protected so some crazy like yourself doesn't attempt to slander him and negatively affect his firm.

A person does not need to think of anyone that posts here as an expert. The people who contribute to this site generally let the news reports and stories speak for themselves.

Freedom said...

@anon: I actually did not at first accept Pierce Harlan as an expert. After following up to double-check his analysis of report after report and article after article, I now have a reader-author trust relationship. None of my respect for what Pierce writes comes from him claiming expert status or his legal background. You can find a lawyer or credentialed person for just about any position you can dream up. Pierce has my and others readers' respect on the basis of quality, truthful writing day after day.

It would not surprise me though if he is a BA attorney who has also done incredible work for justice. And it would not surprise me if he needs to keep his identity protected so some crazy like yourself doesn't attempt to slander him and negatively affect his firm.

A person does not need to think of anyone that posts here as an expert. The people who contribute to this site generally let the news reports and stories speak for themselves.

Archivist said...

Thanks, Freedom. This is not a "legal" blog. We do not give legal advice here, of any kind. I happen to be an attorney who blogs, that's all.

Anonymous said...

This is why you should always get them to sign one of these - LoveContracts.net

Much safer that way.

Anonymous said...

Utterly worthless. She'll just say that she signed it under duress.

We shouldn't promote silly gimmicks like that. Promoting men's rights is serious business.

Archivist said...

Yeah, no more with the love contracts. They will never, ever be upheld.

Anonymous said...

They should be raging that only 4 people showed up out of their group !!!!!!