This post is not about the pros and cons of using polygraphs. It is about a vile double standard that permeates rape law on account of good old fashioned gender politics.
Polygraphs Just Fine For Men Accused Of, and On Parole for, Rape
Men accused of rape have little choice but to submit to polygraphs when requested, because a refusal could be used against them in deciding whether to charge them. And sometimes when men take polygraphs, they fail when they shouldn't, thus providing DA's with a possible justification to proceed with a case that should be dropped. And sometimes police tell men that they are failing a polygraph test, which elicits a false confession. See, e.g., this case from the Innocence Project ("Between sessions of questioning for the polygraph test, Deskovic [a 16-year--old boy] was questioned further by investigators, who told him he was failing the polygraph test. After six hours of questioning, Deskovic confessed to the crime" he did not commit.)
Moreover, persons on parole for sex offenses -- almost exclusively male -- are forced to submit to polygraphs as a condition of their parole. A recent news story highlighted one state's use of polygraphs to insure registered sex offenders are telling the truth: "Many sex offenders on parole or probation in New Hampshire take lie detector tests to help make sure they aren't violating their rules . . . . Each day, some of the state's 600 sex offenders on parole or probation go to an unassuming office in Concord to take a polygraph test. No questions about their lives are off limits, from their whereabouts to secret fantasies they may have. . . . . For some, even the threat of the test is sometimes enough to make them reveal information before a lie is exposed by the polygraph. . . . . When offenders show up for the test, they can choose not to go through with it, but they would then likely be in violation of their parole conditions. . . . . They said that about 10 percent of the time, the polygraph catches violations serious enough to send an offender back to prison. . . . . Most states now have sex offenders take polygraph tests, but in some locations, the offenders have to pay for it themselves."
The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, for example, has upheld the use of polygraphs for this purpose, saying that polygraph testing "produces an incentive to tell the truth, and thereby advances the sentencing goals." The vast majority of states require polygraphs for sex offenders on parole.
The Women Who Accuse Men of Rape: Exempt From Polygraphs
Polygraphs are considered sufficiently reliable when men accused of rape and men convicted of rape and other sex offenses are asked to take them. But the women who did the accusing are exempt from taking polygraphs.
How did this double standard come about? Politics, of course. Rape victims' advocates lobbied state and local governments "to ban or discourage police from asking rape accusers to take polygraph tests. They have contended that women will be discouraged from reporting sexual assaults if police don't simply take them at their word, without question." S. Taylor, KC Johnson, Until Proven Innocent: Political Correctness and the Shameful Injustices of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case, 378 (2007).
We recently explained how this and the avalanche of other rape reforms that were supposedly intended to encourage women to come forward haven't worked. At all. Underreporting has gotten worse, not better. Alleged underreporting is wielded like a sword to continually push for more and more and more rape reforms, and some of the reformers won't be satisfied until rape accusers are permitted to be both judge and jury in the trials of their own accusations.
But the exemption has the force of Federal law behind it. To be eligible for VAWA funds, states and territories must certify that they prohibit polygraph testing of "victims." VAWA provides: "No law enforcement officer, prosecuting officer, or other government official shall ask or require an adult, youth, or child victim of an alleged sex offense ... to submit to a polygraph examination or other truth telling device."
(By the way, notice how the law is worded: it calls the accuser a "victim" of "an alleged sex offense." Not "an alleged victim.")
A Gross, Intellectually Dishonest, and Unjust Double Standard
The double standard cannot be justified on any rational basis. If polygraphs are sufficiently unreliable for rape accusers, they should be deemed sufficiently unreliable for the men accused and the men convicted of sex offenses. As noted above, innocent men sometimes lose their liberty because of polygraph tests. And it is repugnant that men on parole for a rape charge can be sent back to prison because they "failed" a test that is not good enough for the women who put them there in the first place, and that is not even admissible in a court of law. The mischief and evil caused by these tests in some cases may counsel against their use in any case.
But polygraphs seem to be here to stay. Since we insist that the men accused and the men convicted submit to them (and pay for them, too, in many instances), then we must insist the same of their accusers. Period. Let us be clear: no one is interested in causing undue stress to persons who have traumatized by a rape. But is a polygraph more stressful to a rape accuser than a stint in jail is to an innocent man falsely accused? The question scarcely survives its statement. And if you don't think it's common that innocent men are jailed for rapes they didn't commit, spend several weeks (that's how long it will take you) reading through this Web site to see the actual news accounts of that very thing happening, and read the objective studies that put false rape claims approaching fifty percent.
If a polygraph test can keep an innocent man from languishing in jail, accusers should not be exempt from taking them. And if the insistence that rape accusers submit to a polygraph test keeps some hypothetical rape victim from "coming forward" resulting in a rapist remaining at large (and there is no evidence that this would happen), as terrible as that is, that result is preferable to allowing an innocent man to be jailed for a crime he did not commit.
No valid, moral, or defensible rationale justifies exempting rape accusers from submitting to polygraphs if the men they accuse and the men their accusations convict have no real choice but to take them. Exempting rape accusers alone only serves to exalt a politicized agenda to jack up rape convictions over any concern for innocent men falsely accused of rape. But that, after is, is really the purpose of this immoral double double standard, isn't it? To jack up rape convictions, the wrongly accused be damned.
Tuesday, February 23, 2010
Polygraphs are just fine for the men accused and convicted of rape claims; off-limits for the women who do the accusing
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
30 comments:
Of course you are right. Even though some men are released because they passed the polygraph, exempting women from taking them causes prevents a lot of women from recanting early on.
Axel, I would love to see something from the Innocence Project about how innocent men sometimes falsely confess due to the fear of polygraphs, or the belief that they've failed the test. And we are also aware that police have been known to tell men they failed the test just to elicit a confession.
It is most troublesome to me that if innocent men fail the test, that failure might be enough to convince the D.A. to proceed to trial, even though the tests are not admissible in court.
Don't you think it's repugnant that men on parole for a rape charge can be sent back to prison because they "failed" a test that is not good enough for the women who put them there in the first place? And that is not even admissible in a court of law?
Reverse the genders, gentlemen. I know that's tough to do in this case. Would the feminists tolerate for even one second this double standard?
Great job archivist!
I will second that, Great job archivist!!
"Polygraphs are considered sufficiently reliable when men accused of rape and men convicted of rape and other sex offenses are asked to take them."
Polygraphs are complete bullshit, and should not be considered sufficiently reliable for anything.
"Since we insist that the men accused and the men convicted submit to them (and pay for them, too, in many instances), then we must insist the same of their accusers. Period."
While I agree that the same should apply to both accusers and the accused, a much better solution would be to eliminate them entirely.
"While I agree that the same should apply to both accusers and the accused, a much better solution would be to eliminate them entirely."
Right. But given that we seem to be stuck with polygraphs, the double-standard should end.
A problem with polygraphing rape accusers is that prosecutors might be more willing to believe liars who pass the test.
"A problem with polygraphing rape accusers is that prosecutors might be more willing to believe liars who pass the test."
Yes. The experts seem to think that the mere existence of the test helps bring the truth out of liars, but I think you raise an excellent point.
I say Bring It On!
If a 'lie detector' test can be developed, it should be.
Like DNA technology was finally pushed through in the O.J. trial, polygraphers need to "put up or shut up".
The problem with law enforcements current practice of "enabling" false rape accussers is that while enabling false rape accussers to make false rape accussations against anyone at anytime on any whim; they are in effect neglecting their duties to protect the innocent.
"The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, for example, has upheld the use of polygraphs for this purpose, saying that polygraph testing "produces an incentive to tell the truth, and thereby advances the sentencing goals."
Well, that tells you what part of the problem is right there. One of the highest "courts" in the land approves of this because it sends more people (men) to jail. Not because it serves actual justice: because it sends people to jail. Thanks for nothing, you useless men in black!
I agree lie detector tests are BS...I doubt their accuracy is very high.
BUT you are so right that if they have them EVERYONE should have to take them.
It is a total double standard.
Also Pierce I wanted to tell you that you are an EXCELLENT writer!!!
Your points come across crystal clear and you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT about what you are saying.
You are far far far better than the crap journalists that are on tv and in the papers.
I wish I had a network to give you your own show and a newspaper to give you your own PAGE!
Anon at 2:06: Thank you very much for your kind words. Few people talk about writing and style, but I think it's important. Feminist writers used to make fun of men's rights advocates, but now we have a fair number blogging who are extremely intelligent and who are excellent writers. They can attack me, and publicly state they hope I get raped (as they've done), but they lack the capacity to really challenge me. Most of them (the smart ones at least) appreciate that I will chew them up alive.
Rape accusers are exempt from polygraphs because of their traumatic state of mind and "body".
However, to a degree, the accused also are traumatized, especially if they are innocent.
So, considering both sides, and having read a little bit about how the respiratory can effect the outcome, I would think polygraphs should be applied in either instance.
In my own case, I cannot PAY to get a polygraph. One tester explained to me that because of the time lapse, a polygraph would not be beneficial.
HUH?
Polygraphs should never be used to convict anyone of anything, for two reasons. One is that they have a high failure rate. Secondly, they amount to forcing self-incrimination.
If I am accused of a crime, it should not matter whether a machine judges my innermost responses to be those of guilt. The only issue is whether objective external evidence exists to prove I committed the crime
A man accused of a crime should never answer any police questions or agree to a polygraph. Never talk to the police and always say that you have an attorney, even if you don't at the moment. After that, you say absolutely nothing. Once it is known that a suspect has an attorney that person can only be questioned in the presence of the attorney for it to be admissible in court. Even if the suspect confessed to a murder the confession cannot be used and is worthless if his lawyer was not present. Simply by saying that you have a lawyer means that you do not waive you rights even before your rights are read to you.
Archivist, you were working on a check-list for what *not to do or say* to police if accused?
Nick, it's always been my understanding that a polygraph is the best way to determine if a person is lying -- but not necessarily if he is telling the "truth". Does that make a lick of sense?
" A Gross, Intellectually Dishonest, and Unjust Double Standard "
This is putting it too lightly
Anonymous said...
The problem with law enforcements current practice of "enabling" false rape accussers is that while enabling false rape accussers to make false rape accussations against anyone at anytime on any whim; they are in effect neglecting their duties to protect the innocent.
Feb 23, 2010 11:51:00 AM
Excellent point! However, look at these;
Look up the words Feminist Epistemology and feminist jurisprudence.
http://www.iep.utm.edu/fem-epis/print/
http://www.iep.utm.edu/jurisfem/print/
There is also this;
http://www.iep.utm.edu/foucfem/print/
and this;
http://www.iep.utm.edu/irigaray/print/
Zeta said...
"The 2nd U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals, for example, has upheld the use of polygraphs for this purpose, saying that polygraph testing "produces an incentive to tell the truth, and thereby advances the sentencing goals."
Well, that tells you what part of the problem is right there. One of the highest "courts" in the land approves of this because it sends more people (men) to jail. Not because it serves actual justice: because it sends people to jail. Thanks for nothing, you useless men in black!
Feb 23, 2010 1:13:00 PM
and women in black.
Anonymous said...
I agree lie detector tests are BS...I doubt their accuracy is very high.
BUT you are so right that if they have them EVERYONE should have to take them.
It is a total double standard.
Also Pierce I wanted to tell you that you are an EXCELLENT writer!!!
Your points come across crystal clear and you are ABSOLUTELY RIGHT about what you are saying.
You are far far far better than the crap journalists that are on tv and in the papers.
I wish I had a network to give you your own show and a newspaper to give you your own PAGE!
Feb 23, 2010 2:06:00 PM
I SECOND THE IDEA! IMHO, MR. Pierce, MR. Archivist, MR. SlWerner are as sharp as lasers. KUDOS!
Archivist said...
Anon at 2:06: Thank you very much for your kind words. Few people talk about writing and style, but I think it's important. Feminist writers used to make fun of men's rights advocates, but now we have a fair number blogging who are extremely intelligent and who are excellent writers. They can attack me, and publicly state they hope I get raped (as they've done), but they lack the capacity to really challenge me. Most of them (the smart ones at least) appreciate that I will chew them up alive.
Feb 23, 2010 4:29:00 PM
YOU GO DUDE! (I could have said boy but, you are a respectable adult.) I can only hope and practice to write with the same knowlege, wisdom, experience, clarity, authority, and, passion that you, MR. Pierce, MR. Archivist, Mr. SlWerner and,many other do.
Nick S said...
Polygraphs should never be used to convict anyone of anything, for two reasons. One is that they have a high failure rate. Secondly, they amount to forcing self-incrimination.
If I am accused of a crime, it should not matter whether a machine judges my innermost responses to be those of guilt. The only issue is whether objective external evidence exists to prove I committed the crime
Feb 23, 2010 8:42:00 PM
A good point. Should the Constituional rights of a suspect be ignored to seek the truth? This I believe, is a paradox.
I say that anything that circumvents or outright violates a persons rights, is illegal.
No matter what the opinions of both men and women in black are, a persons rights are spelled out in plain language in the U.S.C.
Georgia Girl says
"Archivist, you were working on a check-list for what *not to do or say* to police if accused?"
I say, There are now so many false rape accussations, and an almost Klan type of hysteria to hang innocent men, that there is almost no choice left but to defend oneself anyway possible.
Georgia Girl, you insinuate that pierce is trying to protect the guilty here, But you see if the public became AWARE of what the true percentages of false rape accussations were (it's not 2%), youre attempts at createing more hysteria would be seen as futile.
Georgia Girl wants to create more and more hysteria, to the degree we just lynch all men just like they did black men for rape accussations.
Mass hysteria is barbaric, and the Now "missinformation Alliance" that perpetuates faulty and inflamatory hysteria is also barbaric.
Get gender feminist missinformation hysteria out of our legal system, the mass hysteria it generates is making a "Klan court" out of our legal system.
Georgia Girl, yer hysteria will not stand the test of time. Yer "Klan court" will collapse under it's own weight.
Scott, although I had a motive for that question, you misunderstood. It was not to insinuate that "all" accused men are guilty of rape.
And I'm sure my sympathy for the falsely accused does not always show, but you can bet that I HATE FRA's as much as anyone.
Georgia Girl - "And I'm sure my sympathy for the falsely accused does not always show, but you can bet that I HATE FRA's as much as anyone."
Not the first time you've made this claim.
Sure would be nice to see something you post that actually demonstrated that it was true. (hint, hint)
Polygraph=junk science on crack.
Amazing they even use them at ALL!
Post a Comment