Here's an excerpt from a recent law review article that appeared in the New England Journal on Criminal and Civil Confinement. It explains that the politicization of rape renders it impossible to discern whether underreporting even exists.
If there is one thing this blog is fighting for, it's to end the divisive politicization in this area. The truth is being held hostage by radical feminist ideology. Let's have an honest, objective look at both rape and false rape claims, which, I am certain, will show that the former is not nearly as prevalent as the sexual grievance industry insists, and the latter not only is far more common, but becoming more and more prevalent because it is not deterred. An honest look at these issues will promote a greater respect for the rights of the presumed innocent, many of whom are, in fact, falsely accused; moreover, it will not dampen the public's desire to eradicate rape, it will only heighten it -- because the public will know it is not being fed radical feminist lies.
Here is the excerpt. Some context: the author is questioning the work of other scholars who concluded that underreporting is a fact:
Hanson refers to an article that he coauthored with James Bonta. Their article offers various reasons to support the notion that crimes are underreported. One reason they offer is the slippage in the Uniform Crime Reports. According to Bonta and Hanson, the Uniform Crime Reports underreport because if there is an act consisting of several violent and non-violent crimes, only the violent offenses are counted. The authors do not explain or justify how this counting method contributes to the underreporting of sex crimes. Instead, they point out that the victim reports contribute extensively to the variability in reporting rates for different offenses. Bonta and Hanson did not actually conduct any victim surveys for their article. Instead, they refer to three previous studies done by the Canadian government. In praising victim studies, Bonta and Hanson point out that these studies "have the advantage of detecting crimes that are unreported to the police." However, they also mention the drawback that some crimes are not reported because the victims are not aware that those crimes have occurred or because the victims are embarrassed by the crimes. Curiously, the authors do not offer any reasons why the data from victim surveys might be unreliable (e.g., exaggeration, lack of understanding legal criteria, and making oneself a victim). Instead, they take the survey data from over 61,000 telephone calls and 10,000 interviews at face value to conclude that all crimes are underreported. . . . .
A recent study of sex-crime reporting concludes that serious investigation for rates of sex crimes, free from ideological bias, is only just beginning. In his paper, Philip N. S. Rumney claims that in the past, those influenced by psychoanalytic theory discounted reports of sex crimes, while more recent studies of sex crimes too readily believe victims in spite of the unreliable nature of the studies. He concludes that:
"As a consequence of such deficiencies within legal scholarship, factual claims have been repeatedly made that have only limited empirical support. This suggests a widespread analytical failure on the part of legal scholarship and requires an acknowledgement of the weakness of assumptions that have been constructed upon unreliable research evidence."
It could be the case that sex crimes are underreported. Unfortunately, competing agendas on both sides of the issue have hidden methodologically infirm studies behind rhetoric to obscure the uncertainties in the numbers."
J. Fennel, Punishment by Another Name: The Inherent Overreaching in Sexually Dangerous Person Commitments 35 N.E. J. on Crim. & Civ. Con. 37, 49-51 (2009).
Monday, September 14, 2009
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44 comments:
I don't understand why, but obviously there are a lot of people who will make up a story about being raped in order to feel important. I don't trust the reliability of random surveys for that reason.
If false reporting of rape is as common as it is then it stands to reason that there must be a much larger pool of people who will make up stories about abuse but who wouldn't go so far as to file a false police report about it. As sick as it is, claiming to be raped is a badge of honor for a lot of women.
I read in one of Gloria Steinem's books that if you get a group of five women together, almost invariably one of those five women will tell a story about having been raped. She concluded from this that rape must be really common.
I draw the opposite conclusion: that instead of 1 in 5 women being raped, nearly 1 in 5 women is capable of claiming to have been raped just for attention.
Have you seen AH's video ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RliMu2JxVr0
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Rape Rape Rape Rape Rape Rape Rape
Say this word: S-e-p-a-r-a-t-i-o-n.
Rape Propaganda.
If the femi-nazi can keep the faulty and inflamatory agitation propaganda loud enough (like saying girls and women are being raped all over the place behind every closed door....they just aren't telling)..then this drowns out all sanity and truth.
THATS WHY THEY CALL IT MASS HYSTERA, or MASS HYSTERIA...which ever you prefer...it comes from the same place.
Most men cannot handle the unfortunate fact that the greatest reason for women to lie about rape is...They were late for work, or late for some other obligation.
Hey why not...it's just men/boys lives that get killed over false rape accusations right.
The current practice of American law enforcement..that enables false rape accusations ...is a perversion, and a stain on the American constitution.
The greatest reason women lie about rape is---they’re late for work? Are you serious? Lots of women are proud to have been raped? Really?
None of you are worth responding to. But I have a question about the actual thread post. I remember reading that the police say that rapes are only reported 50% of the time, and rape crisis centers say it’s really about 80% of the time. What about that? I mean, if 80% of the women who came in to a center for services said that they didn’t report it but needed some counseling, wouldn’t that kind of lead one to believe that there’s a lot of underreporting?
How many of those women are drug addicts?
The False Rape Society Disclaimer:
The frequent poster "jeana" does not and never has supported this website or any victim of false rape. She continues to use this website with the primary intent of provoking its supporters into an emotional response by attempting to dispute facts and disrupt normal on-topic discussion. To prevent any further interaction, please refrain from responding to any current or future posts from the username "jeana".
Can you imagine what the government would do if 50% of tax filings were faked? That would be a crisis, but a large percentage of rape reports being false ain't no thing.
America just hates men.
Oh -- and what evidence is there that rape is more underreported than other crimes? I think it's very overreported, and bullshit cases get prosecuted because sex cases get a lot of publicity.
And that's what it's all about.
remember reading that the police say that rapes are only reported 50% of the time, and rape crisis centers say it’s really about 80% of the time.
How does the rape crisis center have any clue about the number of cases that AREN'T reported? It's all bullshit. They spew made-up statistics like this to distract from the fact that so many of their "victims" are just making it up to get attention or services.
Here is a hilarious and sadly typical example of rape hysteria puke: http://www2.oanow.com/oan/news/opinion/editorials/article/editorial_united_way_needs_your_help_so_it_can_help_others/90422/
54 rapes were reported in Lee County last year, 70 percent of which went unreported. Rape Counselors of East Alabama hopes to lower this rate by offering rape prevention presentations.
(70 percent of the reported rapes went unreported! Feminists can't do math.)
1)I am not a frequent poster here.
2)I didn’t really realize that the posts I read in this thread (or in many others, quite honestly) are considered to be “on topic”.
3)I asked a valid question. But I understand that instructing others to ignore me is a way for you not to answer my very valid question.
Anon,
I just left a comment dealing with that article. I wonder how long it will be before I get a comment, or it gets deleted?
Jeana,
If you remember reading that, then please, provide us a link, or citation so we can check it out.
For the police side, how do they know what isn't reported. You can't know, what you don't know.
For the crisis centers, I don't doubt they think that. Of course, they never question if a rape actually took place. And do they urge those who have been raped to go to police? If not, why? I can only assume, that they want rapists to be free to rape again.
And what percentage of those using their services are falsely claiming to have been raped, who actually weren't? We, you and I and everyone here, don't know the exact number, but as we have shown here, morning after regret, having a sexual encounter you wouldn't because you were drunk (not passed out), to cover up infidelity, etc., happen all the time.
So I can state with just as much certainty, that the number of rapes reported to a crisis center are false, and not true rapes. That is the problem with guesses. They are usually off the mark. But the "rape industry" has to get it's funding by inflating the numbers. What do they do if it is determined that someone that has come to them is falsely saying they were raped? Do they remove that from the numbers? Doubtful. They still say, "we had X number of 'reported' rapes". They don't include, "But 25% of them turned out to be false", as that would lower the numbers, thus lower the money coming in. They aren't a neutral party in the equation... they are looking at their bottom line. And anytime funding becomes the all important factor, people do what is necessary to keep it coming. Including making up the numbers.
Meanwhile the number of rapes is down to the lowest number in over 20 years. But the hysteria continues.
Archivist,
I never knew how the police came up with their numbers. As for the rape crisis centers, if someone was only coming in to get services, then why would they be lying? I am assuming they'd want counseling services only. And their job is not to make people report. It's to help them deal with things. Although I'm sure they offer resources to help people to report if they want.
I would like to know if they count numbers who are offered help in reporting and say no thanks, not interested or people who initially say they are not going to report, since they might later change their minds. In which case the numbers would be more inflated.
Why would they lie just to get counseling? For the same reason Crystal Mangum lied to get attention. These are pathological liars. When given a choice between breathing and lying they choose lying. They don't need a reason, just like the people who design computer viruses or who blow people up don't need a reason. If they can get away with it (and they can) then they do it. Plus a lot of women in battered women's shelters are drug addicts looking for a free bed.
Jeana, I have demonstrated previously on this site about how the sexual grievance industry's most respected sources (now THERE'S an oxymoron for you) cite stats for underreporting that are wildly, fantastically inconsistent not just with objective sources, but WITH THEIR OWN STATS for the prevalence of rape. They have zero credibility. They say whatever comes into their brains to scare the living daylights out of women that rape is rampant. I refuse to attribute good will to any of them. They lie. And we must expose them.
jeana,
GET OUT OF HERE!
"It could be the case that sex crimes are underreported. Unfortunately, competing agendas on both sides of the issue have hidden methodologically infirm studies behind rhetoric to obscure the uncertainties in the numbers."
That's the first I've heard of there being any agenda to push the idea that these crimes are not underreported. If there is one, it's not coming from MRA's.
"Most men cannot handle the unfortunate fact that the greatest reason for women to lie about rape is...They were late for work, or late for some other obligation."
No, according to the MacDowell study the number one reasons are 'guilt or shame' (20%) and 'spite or revenge' (20%).
P.S.
Arriving home late from a date did appear on MacDowell's list.
P.S.
arriving home late from a date did appear on MacDowell's list.
Jeanna, when the perverted gender feminist / law enforcement misinformation Alliance is broken.(because it is a stain on the American constitution), then the light will shine on what you are you're perverts want to keep in the dark.
Jeana,
I will bring back your attention to the stats you mentioned. Could you please provide either a cite, or a link please.
You have this tendency to do this when you post. You make statements as facts, but when asked to provide some form of proof, you ignore the request, and shift topic. You have done it here, and you frequently do it over at Glenn's site. Either provide the proof to back up your recollection, or stop making such assertions here please.
If you are going to make claims, please back them up.
Let me clarify: the most respected entities in the sexual grievance industry (I know - another oxymoron) posit numbers for (1) the prevalence of rape/false rape claims that are wildly inconsistent with their stats for (2) the prevalence of underreporting of rape. You need to understand these are two distinct sets of figures. But taking even the major players in the feminist sexual grievance industry and comparing them to one another, make no sense whatsoever. Wildly, fantastically inconsistent. We've demonstrated this fact on our site. It proves that the sexual grivance industry has zero credibility on these issues. Zero. None.
Jeana would do well not to throw out wild, unsubstantiated assertions because we are familiar with every major study in this area.
Don't forget the 'conviction rate factor' either. 'Everyone knows' that rape is 'under-convicted'.
Norm, you are right, of course. But I'm not even talking about reality -- I'm talking about their own stats. They alway toss out a percentage for underreporting (of allegedly real rapes) and they toss out another figure for the prevalanecy of rape claims (one-in-four, with a multitude of variations). The two can't be reconciled in any way. In short, the movement is too arrogant to bother to be consistent.
I do not have a link, nor do I feel it necessary to back up everything I say with annotated footnotes. Because no one else here does that. Nor does anyone on Glenn Sacks. You MRAs make wild assertions which are opinion only. IF you bring up a study or a finding, it is only that which supports what you say. And you dismiss anything that says the opposite of what your conclusion is. And you’re not the only ones who do this; most of those with agendas and ideologies do this.
But anyway, since you guys have all the info, tell me what police say their figures are for the underreporting of rape. I do remember reading 50%. No, no links. I actually do want to know.
You may have never heard this, but "the police" don't all work at one gigantic station. There are different groups of police and they don't always think the same.
The point that you keep missing, Jeana, is that those who say that they know the number of reported rapes are lying. They haven't got a clue as to the real number so they pull whatever they want out of their asses. That's typical of feminists and "victims rights" groups.
And we DO back up what we say all the time. If you ever want to be more than the intellectual equivalent of a 90 lbs. weakling then you'll get in the habit of doing the same.
"You MRAs make wild assertions which are opinion only. IF you bring up a study or a finding, it is only that which supports what you say. And you dismiss anything that says the opposite of what your conclusion is. And you’re not the only ones who do this; most of those with agendas and ideologies do this."
Not FRS. All we want are the facts. We're willing to live with the facts.
When Jeana is called on her bullshit, her hilarious response amounts to: "You guys are just as dumb as I am!"
One minor example: In her Valedictorian address to the 2009 graduating class of UC Berkeley, Emma Shaw Crane, 23, said this: "Even here, this university, one in three women will be sexually assaulted by someone else at this university." OK, let's take her at her word: In 2008, there were approximately 35,000 undergraduate and post-graduate students at UC Berkeley -- approximately 54% of whom were female, or roughly 18,900. Thus, according to Ms. Crane, approximately 6,300 women (one out of three) will be sexually assaulted during their stay at UC Berkely by "someone else at this University." Did you get that? 6,300 UC Berkeley women will be subjected to the worst felony on our criminal books aside from murder
How does this astonishing number compare with actual reports of alleged rapes at UC Berkeley? Let us just say that to get to the number Ms. Crane posits would require underreporting of Biblical proportions; in fact, it wouldn't be fair to call it "underreporting" -- it would be the greatest cover-up in the history of the world. Here is why: in 2007, there were just seven reported rapes on the campus of UC Berkeley, an increase over the two previous years. (By way of contrast, there were 89 reports of burglary in 2007.) Of those seven reported rapes, there were two arrests, and only one of the persons arrested was a student or affiliated with the school. Even assuming that all seven reports of rape were actual rapes (and that is extremely unlikely), and that the average woman on campus will be a UC Berkeley student for four years (also unlikely, even taking into account those undergraduate women who stay on at UC Berkeley as graduate students), and not even bothering to take into account the fact of repeat victims (22.8 percent of college rape victims have been victimized before) -- that would mean that roughly 28 women would report their rapes during their stay at UC Berkeley.
That's 28 reported rapes, as opposed to the 6,300 supposedly actual rapes Ms. Crane posits. That means, according to Ms. Crane, that only .004444 percent of all women who are actually raped will even report it.
Did you get that? Read it again: .004444 percent. Compare that figure with the figures feminists typically toss out as the rate for underreporting. Not surprisingly, this, too, is a moving target, but feminists often claim that just forty percent of rapes are reported. Others claim that only thirty-three percent are reported. Some claim the number is really sixteen percent.
Whatever the numbers, they are nonsense. I could go on and on about this -- but numbers are made up out of whole cloth. The sexual grievance industry lies.
P.S. The truth? No one has much of a real idea if underreporting goes on, or the exact number of false rape claims. One thing we do know: false rape claims are a significan problem, and the needs of the presumed innocent are ignored in the interest of battling rape. And there are too many rapes. Why must we get sucked into this phony feminist game of oppression olympics, supported by made up numbers and lies? Suffice it to say that both false rape claims AND rape need to be eliminated.
Perhaps Crane has a very wide definition of 'sexual assault'. Or else she's intentionally being vague.
Doesn't matter, Norm -- most of them say one-in-four are raped, and a lot say it's one-in-four during their stay at the college. You reach almost as absurd a number.
The fact is, the truth means NOTHING to these people.
jeanna says
"You MRAs make wild assertions which are opinion only. IF you bring up a study or a finding, it is only that which supports what you say."
Scott says, Dr warren Farrel say that the only academic studies that get funding are women-as-victim studies. There will be a time close at hand, when gender feminist dominated academia will lose hegemony.
When society collapses under the weight of its own pork-ocracies, and women outnumber men in colleges 4 to 1, their will be extreme breakdowns in the gender feminist beast.
No matter what the real numbers are, those who induce panic by making these inflated claims are lying. They know that they're just pulling numbers out of a hat in order to make men look bad.
If we could get them to stop lying about numbers, we will have accomplished a major victory.
A part of the problem is that most people don't see the harm that these lies are causing, even if they do take the time to be skeptical.
As for the rape crisis centers, if someone was only coming in to get services, then why would they be lying?
Free room and board, often for substantial periods of time.
To bolster claims of abuse coincident with a divorce or child custody petition.
Free legal aid.
To hide children from their father.
To garner attention and sympathy. I think this similar to Munchausen cases.
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